Stroh

I have a rusted VIN tag (surprisingly -- I thought they were supposed to be stainless steel -- maybe this was a poor quality stainless?).

The driver's side of the bird cage had pretty bad rust (now newly replaced) and it damaged the tag. The VIN is still legible, but the tag is pretty ratty. I'm wondering, do I have a new tag stamped? If so, where would I inquire about that process/product? Secretary of State? It has to be stamped/punched, so maybe a machine shop of somekind with reverse letters of the same size. Are there legal considerations about reproducing a VIN tag? I'm really in the dark here.

Alright experts, what should I do? Any feedback would be appreciated, as always.

The13Bats

I am very curious as to the LEGAL way this is done,

I have been in the market for an old rod like 28-32 and with every POS being called a "rat" I started asking about titles, come to learn on some forums people sell titles for these old cars and even ebay sells VIN tags to be stamped.....I go look at a car with a mismatched title and the seller is very up front about how I will have to FORGE this and break that law...but in the end it will be okay...according to him.
I ran away from him and his illegal car...



Years back the aluminum VIN tag on my VW trike was in poor shape I wanted to restore the trike and paint the frame, not thinking I drilled the rivets and the tag broke into pieces all but one number could be seen when it was laid out like a puzzle.

So I call the DMV they have an officer come look at my mess, she decides it's not a scam and does the paper work,
The new VIN tag is sad, it's a decal with a second clear decal over it,
On the frame of a VW trike getting wet etc...
So that worked on the trike.

But in this case and in the case of a die hard purist that MUST have a VIN tag that looks like what Chevy installed in the factory how is it legally done?

Stroh

Thanks for the input, Bats. That's exactly my question: How do I do it right and legally?

BBCorv70

I tend to doubt it can be done legally. Some DMV depts get very uptight about VINs. I heard of a fellow who removed his VIN tag to clean up his windshield pillar. He called a DMV rep over to witness it being reinstalled, wanting to do the right thing. I hear the DMV rep confiscated the tag, cut it up, then assigned a state VIN number. So much for any value that car may have had. Seemed over the top nasty but you never know with some of these people.

On the other hand I've heard of people freely swapping VIN tags back in the day, never notifying DMV...

Stroh

I may just have to re-attach the damaged tag. If I do a replacement, I'll just provide the original with the car if I ever decide to sell.

It had to be removed to repair the pillar. Surely, I can't be the first to do this or encounter this problem.

Seems like a restamp should be available somewhere. Just not my local locksmith or any of the engraving shops in town. (I just got off the phone with all of them.) More of a pain that I thought.

Mike Ward

This is a slippery slope. Making your own VIN tag or having someone do it is almost guaranteed to get your car impounded by the law very quickly and possibly put you or them in jail. Forget that.

Either live with the tag as-is or have your state issue their own. The second choice will usually kill a good portions of the car's value.

Stroh

How about reattaching the orginal damaged Vin Tag? Is that illegal? I'd hate to think I unknowingly violated a law here. I'll be calling the DMV this afternoon.

BBCorv70

Good point about not being the first to deal with this. Say a body shop had to straighten or repair a windshield pillar. The tag may need to come off. Did they need a witness of some sort to verify the tag actually came from this car? Maybe a body shop could advise you? DMV should certainly know. If you can show the ID numbers appear on the frame and on the block, maybe that would be enough evidence the tag belongs with this car?

BKarol

I always thought it was illegal to buy or sell vin rivets so how would you attach it to your car? Think it might be more complicated. Call the DMV.

I would be suspect of a car that had the vin attached with phillip head screws

540 vette

The only right way is to reattach the original. If you contact DMV you will be opening a can of worms and they might give you one of those DMV tags and there goes the value of the car. It happened to a friend of mine, he has a 57 and the tag was beat. He did the 'RIGHT ' thing and ended up with a state supplied vin tag.

Stroh

That settles it. The original goes back on, damaged or not. Though a perfectionist, I'm not about to devalue the thing I've worked so hard to restore.

With all the birdcage repair necessary on these old vettes, you know someone has had to replace or reattach original VIN tags.

Maybe I will call a body shop, but honestly, I'd rather have a damaged tag than break a law.

gbvette62

I don't know that I would be too quick to call the DMV. I sure wouldn't tell them that you already removed the VIN tag from the car! I might tell them that you need to do a repair in the area of the VIN tag, and ask them what the ramifications of removing it would be.

Basically you have "tampered" with the VIN tag, and I believe there are Federal laws and State laws regarding that. There are states where the DMV will check that the VIN tag is attached with the correct "rosette" rivets. The wrong rivets are a red flag to DMV's (and many potential future buyers), that a VIN tag has been tampered with.

You can buy the correct rosette rivets. They're often advertised on fleabay, but they are illegal to sell or possess, in many states. As a vendor at Carlisle, I've been approached twice by "shoppers" looking for rosette rivets. They clearly didn't look like your typical swap meet shoppers, especially the woman in the business suit, skirt, and heels; carrying a brief case!

As others have said, I think that you'll likely end up with a State issued VIN tag, if you go to your DMV. In most states (if not all), it's probably not legal for you, or the DMV, to re-attach the old tag.

Bowerss2

ok devil's advocate here.... i have seen TONS of restored cars with reproduction VIN tags. MANY of them have been NCRS. I would have one reproduced. no one will be the wiser.


that said it may or may not be illegal where you are. I wouldnt worry about it as long as the numbers match. When was the last time the state inspected your VIN tag?

Mike Ward

Don't think so. A counterfeit GM VIN tag renders a car instantly non-judgeable in NCRS. How do you know the tag was a 'reproduction' vs. state-issued?

Bowerss2

Maybe. But my point is that like it or not people DO reproduce them. And some are so good you will NEVER know the difference. Even if it is a car with those fancy rosette rivets they are available.

And again i am just being a devil's advocate here but what is the harm in replacing a vin tag with one that has the same info on it? I mean you are not attempting to defraud just to restore.

Yes it may be illegal but you are kidding yourself if you say it isnt done and more common than many NCRS people would have you believe. People have gotten damn good at reproducing them. Just like head stamps. Sure there are some half assed ones but people have gotten very good at forgeries

CQRT

Interesting discussion . . I think I would be inclined to photograph it with a good camera to capture as much detail as possible, then call or visit a DMV with the photo and ask their advice.... you can either follow their advice with respect to the legality of replacement, or put the old one back on.

This cannot be new territory in most states - -

To the OP - -good luck.

Mike Ward

Money gets counterfeited everyday too. If you lose a dollar down the drain or your dog eats it doesn't give you the right to print up a new one. There's no attempt to defraud there either but VIN tags are no different.

The 'NCRS people' doesn't get to see everybody's cars- just those that are presented for judging. I know of only 1 or 2 that were called over the last 5 years or so.

In any case, this does nothing to help the OP.

7T1vette

You just need to drive your car to the BMV, tell them your problem and find out how they go about providing a duplicate VIN tag. If yours is still legible and you have the title to go with it, that will verify the legality of the vehicle. Most states have the ability to make a special tag/sticker that is glued or riveted to the driver's door jamb. I'm sure your state has a process for dealing with this issue. Just let them handle it.

gbvette62

This is all true, but a state issued VIN tag will greatly reduce the value of a Corvette.

Some states will re-use the original VIN number on a state issued VIN tag, while others will issue a new state created VIN number. Either way, the state issued VIN tags look nothing like the OEM one, and will kill the value of the OP's freshly restored Corvette.

Nowadays, most states will issue a salvage title and VIN, for any car presented to them with a removed or missing VIN plate. Though really not much different than the state issued VIN, in most people's minds, it's even worse.

The absolute last thing that the OP, or any other Corvette owner should do, is have a state issued VIN tag put on their car!

7T1vette

I think that's just 'bunk'. The owner has the original VIN...it's just in poor condition. He wants to 'restore' the VIN tag. We've suggested that he contact his state's BMV to find out what the options are. In any event, this is NOT the same thing as the state providing a "Salvage" title (totalled car) or a state created VIN (for a home-built vehicle). This is a real, valid C3 with its own VIN, but the VIN plate needs "help".

The BMV will provide input and options. The owner doesn't have to do anything he doesn't want to do. But, if the VIN plate is going to be clean-up/modified, the state needs to tell the owner what he LEAGALLY can and cannot do. Gathering that input is not going to change the value of his car one iota.