BIG JIM 54

OK, maybe I should have checked this but I don't know of any 'Vette owner that has. This is really obscure, IMO.

This evidently happened before I bought the car as I purchased it in New Jersey (the Garden State and why I mention this will become apparant). I drove it out to Calif (I was seeing 26 mpg BTW on trip). But less I digress.

I advise every C4 owner to check this. Take off the top of the radiator shroud and look down in-between the radiator and A/C condensor. I had an entire kitchen trash bag full of leaves, cigarette butts, papers, animal parts and who knows what all piled up in there that literally blocked at least half of the air getting to the radiator.

But here's the rub. There is only two small triangle openings on each side of the front fan shroud that these leaves could have gotten into that area. Everything else is sealed! I have never parked on leaves or under a tree but maybe the past owner did. I guess they blew around and finally stopped enough air to make the engine overheat and warp the AL heads enough so the gaskets didn't hold anymore. And it happened so fast, I didn't notice it until it was too late.

But there's more. I have had the entire engine removed and rebuilt by McJack's Corvette in Santa Ana, CA since these leaves and trash got in there and the mechanic didn't notice it either even after having to evacuate the A/C freon to remove the engine (so Jack says) as well as the radiator coolant and probably having to at least remove the top schroud if not the entire radiator. Is this guy blind or what?

Anyway, my pride and joy is sitting in the garage waiting to find a DECENT Vette mechanic in the whole southern part of Calif so it can be fixed. I trust NO ONE anymore and don't have the knowledge to do it myself. I spent $3300 on this motor (less than 3000 miles ago) for the rebuild and I'm pretty much broke now.

Please post your comments and advise. I need it. How could the trash get in-between the radiator and the condensor? Anybody heard of this before?

Thanks,
BIG JIM


[Modified by BIG JIM 54, 10:23 PM 1/1/2003]

Rob 93ZR-1

That's too bad. It's kinda a C4 thing to have to clean that out once in a while to keep temps in check.

DDSLT5

The C4 is an excellent vacuum cleaner - it'll suck up everything that is on the road, and this is where all your garbage came from. Its too bad that the mechanic never bothered to look for, and clean out the rad - but now you know, and every year you should inspect for trash!!

I also think you have an excellent case for a new set of heads or your money back from this guy, as the main cause of your problems was his neglect.

Good Luck!!

2manyC4s

Sorry to hear about your problem.

This is actually VERY common. These cars are "bottom breathers" and suck up everything. Also you cannot tell what's between the cores unless you remove upper shroud. I've cleaned out many that were 1/3 - 1/2 plugged like yours. Once I actually pulled out an entire plastic shopping bag.

Even though there is little space for debris to get past the AC condenser, the constant high pressure form the moving air works anything that's flexible in there.

Tomulrich

Drill 5 1 1/2 inch holes between the radiator and the condenser at the bottom of the shroud. This will keep things clean and does not affect cooling ability....

BIG JIM 54

OK, here's more info I need before confronting McJack's Corvette. How much of the cooling system HAS to be removed to take the engine out? Is it possible that the top shroud can be left on and the A/C system left charged and still get the engine out?

Please reply before I send a nasty email to Jack.

BIG JIM

bill mcdonald

Oh Man that would bum me out!

I would install some screen over the intake for the radiator.

What I dont understand is you said 2 triangle areas? I have my shroud off right now and mine has a slot maybe 2" tall across the whole bottom that can get air into the radiator part from under teh AC condensor. Maybe your bottom shroud has been bent?

LPDesRoche

You do not have to remove any of the cooling system components to remove the motor. Nor do you have to evacuate the freon from the system. I have done many engine swaps and never once did I do this. Thats not to say that you can't remove all that stuff...but why would a mechanic do more work than is necessary???

BIG JIM 54

My condensor goes right into the two fitted rubber pieces that hold the radiator as well. I don't think there's any space between the condensor and the bottom support but I could be wrong. I'll check it out.
Thanks.

BIG JIM 54

Thanks LP,

That let's him off the hook for the overheating problem but now I got him on the A/C recharge. But he said he'd recharge it for me (R-12) for only $75 and that's cheap enough.

Thanks all for you responses. They were very helpful. But keep 'em coming. I suppose it's absolutely necessary to resurface the heads if they're not cracked, correct?

BIG JIM

scorp508

Jim, LP is right on as always. My '87 did not require removal of the radiator, fan, shroud, anything at all to yank the engine. The AC also did not have to be disconnected or evacuated. All I did was unbolt the compressor from the front of the engine and move it out of the way.

Mervz

:(

2manyC4s

Any time I do major engine work or replacement, I will replace the water pump, remove the radiator to flush & test it and of course flush and replace the coolant. This applies to all vehicle makes. Other models act like a Vette debris collector too. All of this work is quoted in the estimate and explained to the customer.

Phobos84

I had the same problem with mine untill I removed the A/C from the car. I never used it and I wanted the extra power. As far as your heads yes you will have to have them resurfaced. Not that big of a deal. Just check for cracks in them.

grapeknutz

Back in the days when I worked on sprint cars dirt would allways get to the radiator and plug up the surface we tryed screens to no avail its best to pull the radiator out and water blast ( hi pressure) from the fan side to front side and see how much crap is blown out , it might suprise you. :smash:

RocketSled

Did it myself. The AC compressor is on flexible lines. Unbolt it from the block, flip it over and out of the way, yank motor.

DDSLT5

It is truely amazing how much crap can get in front of the rad - I just had my engine upgraded - with a new Ron Davis rad - I thought the original equip rad was clean as a whistle - by looking up from the bottom - it was FILLED with grass and all sorts of crap - and I had no cooling problems either - quite surprising.

:seeya

Speedracer176

I feel for you. My buddy Karl went through some issues with a sorry Corvette mechanic in the Chicago area. I think every state/city/town has at least one shady mechanic.

Do yourself a favor, take your time and find somebody you trust. And let me repeat that, TAKE YOUR TIME AND FIND SOMEBODY YOU TRUST, assuming you do not want to do the work yourself.

FWIW, to pull the motor in your C4, only accessory you need to take off the motor is the a/c condensor (& just move it out the way, be careful not to break the lines) and you need to unbolt the power steering pump. I think there are ~4 bolts that hold the accessory bracket on the driver side where everything pretty much comes off (alt, p.s, air pump)

Good luck and take your time and do it right! Are you in a corvette club? If so mabey you can look to them for help.

Joeyvette

I guess I better clean mine! How does the shroud come off on a C-4. Appreciate the help :cheers:

Aggravated4life

Man,just reading this makes me a little :mad ...all that money spent and now its got to be done again.I feel for you there!

Yeah as you can see,this topic has been brought up many times in the past.Its unbelieveable how much junk gets filled up between the rad and condensor.I even modified my top shroud to slip off without having to disconnect the hose or tranny lines.That way,I can easily take it off in a few minutes and get the shop vacuum in there.
Its something that should be checked every year.
Good Luck with everything and also be sure the fans are working properly as well.