365hipo

Are these legit? I don't see any broach marks on the engine pad.

Nowhere Man

It looks fishy to me. The vin shows jan 4 1965. The trim tag jan 16. A ECL code on a A.O. Smith tag?

66BlkBB

No, as far as I am concerned.

I believe the vin tag should have rosette rivets and these are round. According to the C2 Registry the birth date of this car should be Jan 4, 1965 but the trim tag shows Jan 16 from what I can tell.

peaks

The rivets on trim tag are different and stamp looks quite different than the shown on this picture.





Not sure if this helps.

JohnZ

The trim tag build date code at A.O. Smith is December 16th (E16).

The car's build date at St. Louis is January 5th (per the 5932 VIN).

Engine build date is December 21st. The dates work fine together.

The first letter of the trim code ECL is common on '65 A.O. Smith tags.

The round VIN tag rivet fits in the known sequence of when the rosette rivet was introduced.

65GGvert

If that's an E on the trim tag, it would be Dec 16 for the build and Dec 21st for the engine pad.

Edit: JohnZ beat me

Bill Lacy

+ I dont like the eng. pad surface.

tjstarduster

would this be considered a "matching numbers" car?

65 COUPEDEBLUE

I can see the broach marks. This photo is very good. Remember, the tool that cut these decks was about 10-14" in dia. These marks go from about 11am on a clock face to about 5pm. Dan C.

JohnZ

Nope. Chevy didn't use rotary mills on the deck - they were broached longitudinally (parallel to the crank centerline) in a broach tool (photo below) about the size of a locomotive, driven by a 500-hp electric motor. Only machine shops/rebuilders use rotary mills.

Powershift

Supporting details can be found/read in the 1965 NCRS Judging Manual and in Noland's Book on C2 Restoration.

Engine pad numbers look aged but original.....although pad surface looks like it was subject to a slight/minor rotary cut sometime during its life.

Larry

MikeM

Kerrmudgeon

I'm the farthest thing from an expert, but I would accept it as original if I was looking at the car. If it's a dupe, it's a damn good one!

365hipo

Why are the double 2's on the block stamp different sizes? Same with the double H's.

Powershift

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c1-a...stamp-pad.html

Larry

65 COUPEDEBLUE

Sorry John. I stand corrected. I didn't get into the plant and observe that operation until the early 90's. At that time I thought I saw a rotary cutter machine doing each deck 1 at a time. Guess the old memory is fading fast. I need to hurry up and get my car done before I can't remember where everything goes. Dan C.

vettn

I too believe the trim tag looks real, vin tag rivets are correct (round) and the motor stamp is factory. The pad looks to have had a slight decking most likely for rebuild purposes. I have pictures of vin, trim and motor stamps for 65 vin's 5874 and 5964 (before and after the vin by poster) and both with AO Smith tags to compare. Also, one of these has a motor stamp of F1223HH...and it has the same different "2's" and the same big and small "HH." Also, the assembly date stamp is so typical of many 65's I have in my library...were the assembly date stamp is angled downward and in some cases almost runs off the pad with the last character. I now wonder if the block is a "180" casting. Maybe the poster can check. Picture of the motor stamp I referenced...a car I owned and known original 30K mile car.

oldskydog

John,
A techinicality, but I believe they did use rotary mills on the W block engines at Tonawanda /CFD. Don't know for sure, but I suspect the 74 deg angle didn't work with the broach mill. I've never seen a W block without the rotary marks including several NOS examples.

365hipo

I'm looking to buy this car so I don't have immediate access. How and where do I identify a "180" casting?

Thanks for everyone's input. I'm a newbie with these cars and am learning a ton!

vettn

The casting number is in the same place as the "870" casting for Flint made blocks...end of block, driver's side, just above where the bell housing attaches. It should read 3858180. The 180 block was made in Tonawanda, NY for GM and was used for a short time in place of the Flint, MI blocks (870's) normally used. The only one's I have seen used in Corvettes were right around Christmas of 1964 for the 65 model year vette.

If you do a search on this forum for the 180 casting, you should find a lot of info. I know there was one discussion on this back in May or so. Try this:
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c1-a...p-concern.html